Wednesday, December 22, 2010

A Moral Maze

Sinners are curious people. They cull out certain sins and label them as inappropriate while enjoying the exercise of their own sin. The cast system of sin continues today in the western church. One man can lay up obscene amounts of money for himself and still be considered a faithful church member, but another man who struggles with homosexuality is ostracized until he gains complete victory.

And in a stunning example of self righteousness, the military will allow you to lay down your life for your country but will not allow you to admit you are gay. Today a law was enacted that will change all that. Let us as believers make it clear that the ground beneath the cross is level, and there is no sin too great or too culturally unacceptable that cannot be reached by Christ and His gospel. Some people are born with same sex attractions. The curse has had ramifications for many millennia and it rears its head in all sorts of ways.

It was always a amoral conundrum. They will provide you with the bombs, the aircraft, and the necessary training to drop indiscriminate bombs that kill women and children, as long as you do not admit to being gay. Fallen man has his fallen views of morality. The people who die in those bombings do not care if the bomber was gay or straight. They are just as dead.


Protoprotestant said...

You said:

"Fallen man has his fallen views of morality. The people who die in those bombings do not care if the bomber was gay or straight. They are just as dead."

Exactly. Totally missed in all the hysteria at the moment.

So many Christians treat the military as if it were a Holy is for them I suppose.

I can't see that the military has done anything good or moral in a very long time...if ever when you add true motive.

So to me, if they decided to include homosexuals, who cares? Lost people act....lost!

Now the bullets will be immoral eh? That seems to be the sum of their argument.

Strong delusion.

Glad to see someone grasps what's really important. The Church isn't here to reform the Imperial Legions, and if we did (I speak as a fool)...there would be a new Empire with new legions the next day.

We're here to glorify God in the proclamation of Christ Jesus.

Rick Frueh said...

"So many Christians treat the military as if it were a Holy institution"

When the church supports war, and even invokes divine protection for "our" troops, it indicates a Constantinian view of Christianity that eviscerates the spiritual upon the altar of the earthly.

I know many believers who love Jesus but are deceived in this area. And I also do not discount the courage and heroics of many in the military on a horizontal level. But we are called to a far greater level, one that sacrifices all for a Person with nothing earthly promised in return.

And instead of killing our enemies, we are called to die for them - in the likeness of our Master's cross.

Anonymous said...

To use the words "who cares?", as you do, dishonours God's holy name.

You ought instead repent and pray to God in order to start to care about the lives of God's creation!

Anonymous said...

Rick Frueh,
Instead of killing our enemies, we are called to love them as ourselves!

Protoprotestant said...

When I say, "Who cares,"

I mean, the military is involved in wickedness. If people repent, they'll get out of it. I did.

Rather than redeem it...if it were redeemed it would cease to be.

It's not going away, so in that sense as an institution....I don't care if they start wearing pink camo.

As far as individuals in that institution, I hope they repent and exhibit their repentance by getting a discharge.

I'm not sure if you'll see the distinction.

You probably don't agree with what I said either, but I wanted to clarify.

If I sounded flippant, I didn't mean to...but I find the whole discussion and massive amoung of energy being spent on this in Christian circles as yet another big distraction.

We redeem creation with the gospel, not by using the military or pushing for or against legislation that affects it.

Anonymous said...

Anon: I do not read that Protoprotestant said, "Who cares that people ARE gay?" But he says,"Who cares if the military decides to include homosexuals that openly admit it." Because they include plenty of other on-their-way-to-hell-while-openly-admitting-it sinners like fornicators, lovers of money, liars, haters, etc. as of such we once were. I do not see how an unredeemd wordly institution like the american military, by including sinful people, dishonors God's Name, any more than ALL SIN and ALL WORDLY INSTITUTIONS dishonor God and His Name. The fact is, unregenerate unredeemed homosexual people need to be saved from SIN, whether they are in the military or not, just as any unregenerate unredeemed person needs to be saved from SIN. The specific sins of sinners, whether homosexual conduct or others mentioned in the New Testament, are not the problem, but the fruit of the problem, which is the depravity of unredeemed man dead in his sins. Therefore, as Proto says, the Church's commission is to proclaim the redeeming gospel of Jesus Christ that delivers us from SIN, to people; not to try to outwardly reform the behavior of military legions.

Rick Frueh said...

We are not of the world. We should find it curious that the world culls out certain sins and will not allow those who are gay to be paid killers. I do not care what the military does because I am not of them.

I believe that is what Protestant meant.

Protoprotestant said...

Yes, thank you to both anon and Rick....I guess I wasn't making myself clear.

I'm still not sure that will be satisfying, but the two of you certainly understand what I meant.

I think? I was agreeing with the thrust of the post.

Anonymous said...

Rick Frueh said... I do not care what the military does because I am not of them.

That sort of thinking, Rick, is unchristian. In order to help people in any walk of life, we must "care" what they do and say!

Apart from this topic, I have found what you have written, Rick, very helpful!

Rick Frueh said...

I know and care about many people in the military. But I do not concern myself with what they do because I am a pacifist. Violence does not support the kingdom of God in the gospel age.

Our mission is to mirror the cross, not the twelve legions of angels Christ could have called.

Anonymous said...

The military is made up of individuals. God created every single person in the military and planted a measure of faith in each of them!

Members of the military are God's creation and they should be blessed with opportunities to discover Jesus Christ.

Jesus said, "Go ye into the world and preach the gospel".

Jesus doesn't mean for us to avoid preaching the gospel of Christ to members of the military !

Let's not forget that we are commanded to love our neighbour as ourself!

God will bring about reformation and transformation to members of the military when we take His word more seriously.

God will decide also to what degree people are dishonouring His name, for He is sovereign Judge!

Yes, you are correct to mention the the depravity of unredeemed man that is dead in his sins, yet for the individuals concerned the specific sins of sinners are not just part of the problem but a huge part! let's respond to their needs compassionately, rather callously avoiding our reponsabilities! God bless you!

Anonymous said...

Living faith,living hope and living love are active!

I don't agree with what you said, because although it is in the right direction - in the sense that it could be a starting point for you to put faith into action just saying, "I hope they repent and exhibit their repentance by getting a discharge", will not be very impacting if it just stays in your heart locked away- indeed God says that "faith without works" is dead!

God is Our holy example and He is very mindful and watchful over the behaviour of the saved and unsaved.

How can I be a blessing to people who study the Koran, for example, unless I am actively working to free them from their sinful stronghold?

To God Triune be the glory!